A Moral Question

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A Moral Question

Post by Connie on Sat May 08, 2010 9:58 pm

Not a dilemma because I know exactly how "I" feel. Background: When dh and I got married his cousin was in a "program" (I say that out of contempt that it wasn't prison) for sexual abuse of a minor. When he completed that, he moved back in with his gf who had six kids including his. He didn't follow his parole requirements and has been in prison for the last 8-9 years. He got out last month.. He is a registered sex offender.

The gf lets him come to the daughters parties etc.. Me and Dh do NOT want him around Katie or our grandbaby. However, dh is VERY close to his family including this side of it. I don't think he has told them how he feels. We have already decided not to go to the family reunion this year because we know this guy will be there..

Tonight his Uncle showed up with the guy (who is his son) to look at a truck next door. Dh went out and dealt with it and I refused to go outside when I saw he was here. Katie was no where around so that wasn't an issue.

So here is the problem.. If DH brings this up to his family it is going to create a HUGE rift between us and his dad and uncle.. So now what?

We have already decided NOT to go to the reunion because of this guy but I feel guilty about the people who WILL be there with their kids who do NOT know this guys history because his parents covered it up for him. Plus I feel bad about what is going to happen between dh and his family.. at the same time I feel that is HIS problem and not mine.. but I still feel bad.

Personally I want to make a bunch of posters with the guys pic and info and go down to the park the night before and post them all over the place..

Unfortunately.. Idaho has no laws about these guys being in public parks around kids or even these guys LIVING with kids.. it sucks.
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Re: A Moral Question

Post by thebigscott on Sun May 09, 2010 1:23 am

I can't believe Idaho doesn't have laws preventing sex offenders from trolling for kids. That's awful.

I would not go to the reunion and be very honest about why. It doesn't even have to be judgemental in attitude. There's no need to say, "I don't want that sick bastard around my kids." You can just say that you aren't comfortable.

I kind of feel bad for pedophiles. Not that I think what they do is OK, but I understand that it's hardwired in. They didn't choose to be aroused by kids and there's nothing they can do to make those feelings go away. That being said, I also know that BECAUSE it's hard wired in, this is not something they get over. That urge will always be there and the risk they pose is too great to allow them to be in the general population.

I was going to suggest that you call the local police where the reunion will be to see if they could intervene. But since the laws in Idaho suck I don't know what you should do about warning the others. They do need to know, but you would really be burning bridges with DH's family. Is there a family gossip that you could let know about it? Someone who would spread the word?
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Re: A Moral Question

Post by kleenaechs on Sun May 09, 2010 10:36 am

This sux for sure! Something similar is going on in my sister's family. Her dil comes from a family that many live next to each other on a cul de sac. My sister's dil's mother, lives next to her sister. Sister's son was molested years ago, but got no help (he is now 13). He has been caught with my sister's youngest grandchild (3 at the time). The entire family is fighting now because some believe and some don't (3 year old kids don't lie though). There is lots of drama because dil won't bring the kids to the family "compound" now. Much talk of killing is going on and my sister is very afraid someone in this crazy family is going to act on the threats. Especially now that the now 4 y/o grandson has been caught with other kids, doing what was done to him. Authorities were called at first, but they found nothing. Now that it has happened more, authorities have been called again and intensive counseling is happening for the 4 y/o, but the family drama escalates daily. Good luck to you, it will likely be a tough road for your family too

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Re: A Moral Question

Post by Lori on Sun May 09, 2010 10:57 am

I'm one to avoid drama at all costs. So for me, I would quietly make excuses to not attend the reunion and let others deal with their own decisions. My instincts have really served me well, and I'd continue to avoid the guy. He's not going away, apparently, so other families are going to have to deal with him or not as they see fit.

Kleenaechs, I just don't understand the family dynamic that causes people to cover things up and deny that they happened. So sorry that your sister has to deal with that. Again, keep your own family safe, that's priority number one. I hope your sister's DIL stays strong. I don't think explanations or debate are necessary. Leave the drama to those who thrive on it and remove yourself from the people who are in question whether feelings are hurt or not.

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Re: A Moral Question

Post by trax on Sun May 09, 2010 11:43 am

Yikers, does this post elevate your blood pressure or what! I cannot believe Idaho does not have laws stopping/removing sex offenders. I would be contacting the governing bodies in charge, finding out why this law does not exist - maybe there are folks working to legislate a new law to protect children.

I agree with Lori - I too, do not understand why a family would cover up this barf. These are children, kids next door. Imagine what their life is going to be like as the age. A sad, fallen situation indeed.
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Re: A Moral Question

Post by chelle on Sun May 09, 2010 12:01 pm

I"d be blunt and say "I aint goin 'cause that bastard is gonna be there" But, I am just that type. honestly. I love my family dearly, my heritage is VERY important to me, I love to see and visit my family, but, I dont play. I think that pedophilia is a capitol crime, and should be at the very least punished with castration, and really wish it was punishable by death.
and I'm not blowing smoke, if they let us vote on a law like that, I'd be their biggest advocate. (can you just see me putting on the "kill pedofiles" banquet, like I do the Hunting Heritage and Friends of the NRA banquets? LOL )

this is what happend with my grandfathers new wifes grandkids. she had a 13 yo GS- and one that was a year or so older than BRett.

THey were/are both ... crazy.. I mean, literly- like on phsycotic meds and stuff. the youngest who is 12 or so now got booted from school because he punched a cop, and faught with another one on the school bus, because the kid in front of him wouldnt put up his window....

BUT a few years ago:
I made it clear that mine were NOT to be around them. FOr one, I didnt like the way they acted, for 2, they were HUGE, and if they decided to flip out they might kill one of my kids. we are talking they go NUTZ! throwing desks and chairs in school and shit.

everyone ignored me.
THEN, Brett came home and said that the oldest tried to 'have sex' with him. tried to kiss him and tried to lay on top of him. BRett jumped up (he was maybe 8 at the time) and started screaming that he was NOT gay, and to leave him alone before he killed him.

They came home and told me. I went balistic. I forbid them from being within spitting distance of my kids EVER Again. and I was VERY blunt about it.

at first I got the 'kids will be kids' crap- then I got the 'why are you trying to keep your grandfather from seeing your kids' guilt trip, (they were letting these children live with them- not my problem) I told them all that I loved my grandfather deeply, he raised me, he was my father, but I would NOT put my kids in danger because he had to marry the first woman he came across after my grandmother died. that was HIS descision, and that anytime those children were not THERE he could see my kids.

Things are much better now, folks are seeing MY point of view, and those children are not allowed to intereact with mine and the family respects that. But that wasnt always the case. they would sneak around and let them together. everyone thought "we will just watch them close" NO- for one, this happend when they were playing the 'playroom' while my grandfather was there. two, I am VERY strait forward. I dont play games. One day I was working at the store, by myself, got a call that my kids and those kids were on a family picnic with grandfather, all his sisters etc. I locked up and left, got my kids and told them all that when I say NO- I mean NO- deal with it..

Also, my mother decided to start drinking and doing drugs again. she no longer sees my children. I dont even 'supervise' visits. Not worth it to me. My kids dont need to be subjected to the bullshit.

SHe has got half the family mad at me, (great aunts and uncles on my granmothers side)- because she wont tell the whole truth. I could care less. had one ask me in walmart the other day "why wont you let your mom see these kids? she loves them soo much and is sooo depressed, she doesnt do drugs, she told me so- some of her friends might but she swears she is clean... " I wont be shamed into anything- trying to shame me pisses me off more, and you REALLY get told.

I said "because, I dont want my children raised around crackheads. I dont care whose feelings it hurts. We dont play that way. when she straitens up, grows up and acts like a 55 year old woman and not a child, we might can talk- until then, my children and I are happier than we ever have been"

I belive you have to forgive others for God to forgive you. But God does NOT say that once you forgive someone you have to welcome them back into your life and family. He simply says to hold no grudges, that judgement is his. I have fogiven these people - but I will not let my children around them anymore than I would let them around John Wayne Gasey. And if he, or one of those people walked into my yard, I would have no issues with stepping outside - armed if nessasary in JWG's case- and telling them to back the &#*) up.

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Re: A Moral Question

Post by Lori on Sun May 09, 2010 12:21 pm

That's exactly what I'm talking about, Chelle. Protect your own and let others play the games if they feel they must.

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Re: A Moral Question

Post by kleenaechs on Sun May 09, 2010 12:39 pm

You do have to do what your gut tells you is best for your family, no matter how hard it gets. chelle your story sounds somewhat like some things going on with my sister's dil. The family is split and some say things like - we watch them real good so you don't have to worry. We think the little grandson was molested much more than we first thought because he is doing it to other kids now. But the time we found out about it, they were being babysat by their grandma and playing in the next room. Dil got so much crap, even from her own parents. Her mother complains about why do the kids still get to go to my sister's house, even though she knows it happened at her house on her watch.Dil tells her it is because there are no child molesters at my sisters, but her mother doesn't seem to get it. At a birthday party last fall for another of the grandkids, she was very ugly to my sister and to me. I have nothing to do with any of it and was just trying to be nice by speaking to her. She acted like I wasn't talking to her. At another birthday party for the other 2 grandkids, a few weeks ago, she showed up drunk, and still wouldn't speak to my sister or me. We also heard she complained about where we got to sit and other stupid stuff.
This past Christmas, dil and my nephew, took their 4 kids to give their grandparents their Christmas gifts. They went at 6:30 am so as not to cause any trouble in the cul de sac. When they went to leave, dil's aunt and grandfather were outside and tried to start a fight. In front of the children they yelled obscene and ugly things and threatened violence. In the end they let them leave without violence, but said it was only because it of Christmas

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Re: A Moral Question

Post by edbson on Sun May 09, 2010 12:55 pm

I say follow your gut, it is NEVER wrong. There are people in my family that we do not associate with, some don't like it, they can kiss my ass. I am NOT going to put my kids in danger, or have them in the middle of stuff. Wanna be a crackhead/pillhead/criminal, then so be it, but I do not have to expose my 12yo child( and she is very much a child) to that.

Honestly Connie, I would tell people exactly why you are not going, they have kids too, and need to know. I would make a fake email addy, and send everyone I knew the link to the sex offender registry, with his pic and offense

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Re: A Moral Question

Post by thebigscott on Sun May 09, 2010 1:04 pm

Oh shit, kleenaechs! I can tell you now, I wouldn't ever go back to that cul de saq. Family is important, but not THAT important. Not important enough to risk your child's safety.

And Chelle, I'd go to that banquet! Just because I feel sympathy for pedophiles doesn't mean I would behave any differently. I look at it like a rabid dog. It shouldn't have had this happen to them. But there is no treatment and they are a huge danger to others. I feel bad for the dog, but I'm still in favor of shooting it.
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Re: A Moral Question

Post by thebigscott on Sun May 09, 2010 1:06 pm

edbson wrote:I would make a fake email addy, and send everyone I knew the link to the sex offender registry, with his pic and offense

THAT is brilliant! They do need to know if at all possible.
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Re: A Moral Question

Post by chelle on Sun May 09, 2010 2:04 pm

yep Karen, just like a rabid dog- or a dog that attacks you/yours. no matter how hard it might be, or heartbreaking it is, when the time comes you know you have to pull that trigger. Some folks dont have the balls to do it. Others do. standing up for what is right and saying "I cant be a part of this" is akin to pulling that trigger. I think that you are doing the right thing Connie, and deep down, so does your husband. Smile Its just hard to be a hard ass when it comes to family, till you do it that first time. Then you start to realize that it really does make life simpler.. or it did for me.

My kids just spent 2 hours practically in my mothers front yard. our garden is across the dirt road from her house. but they know the rules.. dont take candy from crackheads. And she is learning, she doesnt even accost them anymore when they ride by on their bikes. LOL

At birthday parties, (at my great aunts house) she does come, she doesnt talk to me, she does talk to the kids, and puts on the 'poor me ' show, wiping tears away, I dont even let it phase me. and noone speaks to me about it either. They either understand, or are smart enough to keep their mouths shut. She always leaves early and is sober at the parties.

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Re: A Moral Question

Post by KellyM on Sun May 09, 2010 4:30 pm

As the parent of a child that has been molested, I will tell you that if I even suspected that Wynonna's father would have molested her, she never would have gone on her visitation with him. I did find out at a later time that in the past when he was younger, he molested his younger sisters, and their mother never did anything about it. Had I known this beforehand I would have taken precautions and he would have had supervised visits only and what happened to Wynonna would have never happened. I would find a way to let people know what he is and that he will be there. Hardwired or not Karen, what Wynonna had to go through and me having to watch her go through it, I cannot feel the slightest bit of pity for child molesters. I think they should all be put on an island with no way to get off and left to fend for themselves. Thats actually the kindest scenario I can think of, there are many others that I have thought of that are not. If someone can look into the eyes of an innocent child and do something so depraved and sick, they are evil in one of it's worst forms. I think they are a complete waste of human space. They are taking up space on this planet and someone else who is actually worth something could be in their place.
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Re: A Moral Question

Post by trax on Sun May 09, 2010 6:33 pm

What is really sad is these folks take up space in prisons - and who do you think pays for it? The Taxpayer - you and I - and even in Canada. Sad
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Re: A Moral Question

Post by KellyM on Sun May 09, 2010 6:38 pm

Yes, and we pay for them to have cable and they have prison stores where they can purchase just about everything.
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Re: A Moral Question

Post by chelle on Sun May 09, 2010 10:20 pm

and they are not really treated badly in prison. I can assure you of that. people dont know what your 'in' for unless you tell them. Its a civil rights violation to find out. Bosses (the officers) can be fired for it.

when BR was at prison, they always would find out (under the radar of course) and wouldnt let them get good SSI jobs (ssi is a level of inmate that gets to work.)

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Re: A Moral Question

Post by KellyM on Sun May 09, 2010 10:29 pm

No they're not, and they keep them in protective custody with others of "their kind". Atleast that is what they did with him in our case.
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Re: A Moral Question

Post by edbson on Sun May 09, 2010 11:19 pm

Here they are in GenPop, and the other inmates DO find out, no protective custody in Jefferson or orange counties.

The commisary is only because their idiot relatives send them money, hell, ramen noodles at the county jail here are $1 a pack, same ones I get 10/$1 at HEB

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Re: A Moral Question

Post by Connie on Mon May 10, 2010 12:55 am

Wow I am so sorry to hear how many others are going through this same thing or have gone through it!

Why do they protect the offender? Because he is family and they want to believe that it was all a "misunderstanding".. that is at least my best guess. I have tried to imagine myself in his parents shoes.. no go..

My stepson came to visit and tried to choke Katie when she was about two.. I had NEVER left him alone with her just on a "feeling".. this incident.. I was in the living room and they were five feet away in the kitchen.. We immediately took him to the physchiatric hospital.. (sounds like overkill but this wasn't the first incident in the month he was here, it was one of many different things).. THEN we found out he had molested his sister and his invalid grandmother (he was 12 at the time)..

Point being. we did what we had to do in order to keep the rest of our family safe.

This one is just tough.. the uncle showed up yesterday WITH the cousin.. luckily Katie wasn't home and I refused to even go outside.. dh doesn't want him in the house at all so they weren't even invited in..

It is such an insane situation and ridiculous.. I can't believe that Idaho will tell these sex offenders that they can't work at schools or daycares, can't live within 500 feet of one but they can live with kids and they can go to parks?

You are all right and DH is just going to have to bite the bullet and deal with it. Today he wanted to know the exact time of my eldest college graduation. His uncle ADORES her and is so proud of her. When he asked for the info I told him "not if "J" is going to be there.. His way of preventing that was to tell the Uncle that she can only have so many people there. I told him, that's not good enough.. you are going to have to be blunt..

It's SO hard for him and I feel so bad that he in this situation but I also don't like that he left the door open for the possibility that this cousin will show up.
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Re: A Moral Question

Post by tara on Mon May 10, 2010 12:20 pm

I'm pretty liberal but I agree with Chelle 100% Kill em or at the very least castrate them. I have NO sympathy. I would be very blunt and vocal.

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Re: A Moral Question

Post by chelle on Mon May 10, 2010 1:02 pm

kinda off subject, but one good thing to come out of the prison system is 'spread' I LOVE it- it sounds nasty as hell, but its SOOO good, kinda like a frito pie wrap at sonic.

cook 2 beef raman noodles
add in
1/2 can of generic squeeze cheese
2 cans of canned roast beef,
1 or 2 cans of generic chili (I buy walmart brand)
half a bag of frito's (or any corn chips)
warm it up, put it on tortillas or eat with chips.
add some jalapanos.

the inmates make it in prison, they just gather what they can from the commisary, they put 'jack mack' in instead of roast beef. its canned mackrel, VERY nasty, you have to debone it and all- and stinks worse than sardines.

but its REALLY REALLY Good. LOL

I agree with you connie, because if you let them have an inch, they will take a mile.

Maybe the best approach isnt to tell the 'family' maybe its to tell him directly. call "J" have hubby meet him, and you go too, and tell him. "Look, I dont care who wants you to come around us, who invites you to go somewhere, but you are NOT welcome around us. Either YOU can decline all invites where we will be in the vicinity, OR we will make a scene when you get there."
"this is your OFFICIAL DISinvite to anything that concerns us. NO matter who tells you "its alright" ."

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Re: A Moral Question

Post by briteasafirefly on Wed May 12, 2010 7:11 pm

There may not be laws set up, but I bet CPS should do something about...you can put in a annoymous tip about the situation, so family won't know you did it and it has to be looked into.
you don't even have to have proof to put a tip in, but if you expect that its possibly happening then definitely call.

you don't have to explain yourself to family about personal choices you make for the safety of your family...

plaster signs all over that park...or at least leak that info to the family gossip.
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Re: A Moral Question

Post by chelle on Thu May 13, 2010 10:04 am

good idea Jessica!!

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Re: A Moral Question

Post by Connie on Thu May 13, 2010 8:04 pm

I wish this family HAD a gossip Jessica.. hehe. Unfortunately the family member who turned him for breaking probation the first time is now divorced.. HOWEVER.. she does have a little daughter and she has done everything she can to make sure he won't be around her kid (he is the uncle). Like I said.. the laws don't prohibit him from living with kids.. so she can't get her daughter away from him since her ex had visitation rights and lives in the same house.

I hate and my husband hates what it's going to come down to but we will not let Katie anywhere near him. As for the other kids.. I just may have to show up early and do the flyer thing. Which is illegal and which might get me thrown in prison.. Will you all at least write to me while Im there?
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Re: A Moral Question

Post by tara on Fri May 14, 2010 2:37 pm

I'll write you Connie! You can go early and tell everyone as they come.

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Re: A Moral Question

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